Marriage between two people

Marriage is a union between two people that love each other. My religion tells me that I should not accept the relationship between two people of the same sex, they also tell me abortion is wrong and that I should not use contraceptives. Even though I still like a lot of things about my religion I do not believe in some of their rules, specially the one about marriage.

I have seen several marriages fail. If I knew back when I was 19 what I know now I would have told half of my friends not to get married, and I would not have done it either. While not all of them are divorced I have seen plenty of them very unhappy and felt almost trapped by situations they did not want to be in. However I still think a marriage is a beautiful thing if it happens with the right person.

The other side to this is that I have friends that date someone from the same sex and would like to get married. I really do not see why it is that a marriage is not about the love of two people but about what sex those two people are. If a homosexual couple can adopt a kid, they they should also be allowed to get married.

I guess it is easy for me to think this way since I believe that homosexuality is not a choice. The moment you start thinking that a homosexual can be reformed to be heterosexual you enter very dangerous territory. I think that the law should allow people of the same sex to get married and make every single couple go through a course before they get a marriage license.

Just today I heard about a couple getting married next week, the guy wanted to enter the church to the theme of the wrestler Steve Stone Cold Austin. If that is not a reason to say that someone is not mature enough to get married I am not sure what is. Thankfully he was talked out of, but maybe he should be thinking about what journey he is embarking on and that it is not a face spectacle like professional wrestling is.

22 comments on “Marriage between two people

  1. I’m guessing that you are Catholic? I was raised in that church, but because of the things you brought up up, I do not practice the faith today.

  2. Nothing wrong with having something fun at the wedding… just Wrestling to me seems somewhat childish and immature. I do know some people (adults) still think is real, and cool… those people scare me.

  3. Government marriage is not about love or religion – or atleast, shouldn’t be. If it was, then there would be no rationale to prohibit gay, polygamous, or any other adult consenting union and call it marriage. Do you, for example, also favor polygamy? If not why not?

    Government marriage is primarily, and has always been founded, on the ability to produce children. This is why when two people of the opposite sex declare their eternal love and sexual union, the government pays attention. It knows that such relationships are likely, atleast historically, to result in children. And since children are a primary concern of the state and the ideal upbringing of a child is with both parents, the state has an interest in preserving and acknowledging such unions.

    No such interests exists in gay unions. Having the state acknowledge gay unions is about as logical, from a purely secular state interest perspective, as having the state acknowledge platonic relationships, like ‘best friend for life’ commitments. Both relationships are inherently unordered towards children.

    Of course gay couples can adopt children (whether or not this is a prudent law is a different story), but so can heterosexual unions. In other words, heterosexual unions, with one male and one female, is the fundamental unit (or ‘nuclear family’, as some call it) of all families. They can do what any other union can also do, plus one more thing – inherently produce children. ANd as such, they should be given special and unique status. IMHO.

    That’s the fundamental argument in the gay marriage debate. Not whose religion is correct, and whether or not they love each other. Gay marriage opponents are perfectly okay with your religion having its own ceremony allowing gay marriage…what they are against, is making it a state law.

  4. Logtar, I am also assuming you are Catholic.

    I just wish there were more Christians walking around the planet like you. You speak the truth. And speak it well.

  5. Besides the whole acceptance of the society thing, I believe that homosexual marriage should be legally allowed to protect people in a relationship after one of them passes away. It has happened in the past that one person in a relationship of years passes and then the government takes over a state that should have been shared. That is just one example of why it should be legally allowed.

    I completely disagree with what you call the bases for a family. Plenty of married couples cannot have natural children. A family can be a single mother, a grandparent taking care of a kid, a group of siblings that lose their parents… family is what you make it, family is the building block of a society and two people from the same sex can be the base for a family… at least in my opinion.

  6. I agree – with two caveats, civil unions instead of marriage and civil unions that are sex neutral.

    From an old article:

    ” In other words, domestic partnerships, if states elect to have them, should be nondiscriminatory and inclusive. They should be available to people based on needs, not on sex. The law certainly should not discriminate in favor of those unmarried people who are in sexual relationships over those with the same needs who, though committed to caring for each other, are not sexual partners. Widowed sisters living together and looking after each other, or an unmarried adult son taking care of his elderly father, may have the need for domestic partner benefits such as hospital visitation privileges and insurance rights.

    A constitutionally sound domestic partnership law would not discriminate against such people by excluding them from eligibility simply because their relationships are not sexual–just as a nondiscriminatory and inclusive law would not undermine marriage by treating unmarried sexual partners as if they were married.”

    I didn’t mean to imply that other unions are not families, or that marriages must result in kids, only that heterosexual unions can produce kids and that they are the fundamental unit to all other families. In other words, they are special and the common denominator to all others (even single moms, at one point, had a male-female relationship).

    I am curious though, what are your views on polygamy? Polyandry? Where do you draw the line, and why? After all, I am sure they love each other too.

  7. I’m with you Logtar. I’m Catholic. I don’t agree with everything handed down from Rome, but I still practice my faith as I see that none of the others seem to be any better.

    I also agree, if your using a Wrestling theme to enter the church on your wedding…well you probably aren’t ready to take the plunge. However I think some lawyers might want to attend that wedding for potential business in the next few years.

  8. To me, the definition and the essence of marriage has always been man and woman. Why is it being forced to accomidate something it was never meant to?

    As far as Catholisism is concerned, I don’t know what gets handed down from Rome, but last time I read the bible it said: Genesis 2:22-24

    22 The LORD God fashioned into a woman the rib which He had taken from the man, and brought her to the man. 23 The man said,
    “This is now bone of my bones,
    And flesh of my flesh;
    She shall be called Woman,
    Because she was taken out of Man.”
    24 For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and be joined to his wife; and they shall become one flesh.

  9. I still don’t see what the big freaking deal is about having a silly theme song played when you walk into the church.

    If I’m paying to be married, what should it matter what song is played over the PA system when I walk in? If I want to have the theme from 2001: A Space Odyssey playing, does that make me any less committed of spouse? If I want to have that “You’re the best around” song playing, what difference does that make?

  10. With gay marriage comes gay divorce. Both are messy. It’s best to simply stick with the legal and religious definitions of marriage. Marriage is a religious union. If you really want to get technical, the government shouldn’t even recognize marriage if you believe in the separation of church and state. Extreme? Maybe…

    Today marriage is less about love and more about taxes and benefits. Ridiculous.

  11. “With gay marriage comes gay divorce. Both are messy.”

    Straight marraige and straight divorce is messy. What in particular about gay people being involved would make it any more “messy”?

    “Today marriage is less about love and more about taxes and benefits. Ridiculous.”

    Not sure about anybody else, but I got married for love. If you (not YOU, Travis, but the collective you) get married for no reason other than tax/benefit perks, then you really shouldn’t be pissing and moaning about the “sanctity” of marriage to beginwith and it shouldn’t matter to you if a committed gay couple wants to have the same perks (be it declared, committed love or “taxes and benefits”) as a committed straight people.

  12. I agree with you. Most aspects of religion I agree. There are those close-minded “so-called born again christians” that really put me on edge. I grew up in a bible belt area of Missouri, where if you didn’t go to church EVERY Sunday and Wendesday, you were going to hell. This is one of the reasons I don’t go to church. I find it very funny when people say they ‘Practice’ their religion is that because after a few millennia they can’t get it right? Religion should be a comfort to the soul. A belief. Not a practice. Practices should be left to Doctor’s and Lawyers.

  13. I went to a wedding in which the music played at the end was the final march from Star Wars. They are still married, but I am sure that it is in no small measure due to her maturity, not his.

  14. Just because Genesis tell the story of Adam and Eve doesn’t mean that gay marriage is wrong. That’s one of my frustrations with The Bible is that people use it for their own interpretation, not to mention the fact that it was still written and compiled by men. Just because something was included doesn’t mean that things that were excluded were wrong. I just find it hard to believe that the God that people believe in that teaches about love and tolerance would be so discriminatory.

  15. Still, I don’t see how playing a wrestling theme song at your wedding indicates that one is not ready to be married. If you look at the whole “formal wedding” thing anyways, I think most of it is absurdly and inappropriately all for show. I would argue that doing things outside the norm is in fact a sign of inner strength that will serve as a strength to the marriage as a whole.

  16. To Becky -> All I was trying to say by that was marriage from the beginning was between man and woman. That is how God made it and just now people are trying to change it. That was just one example I was using to back that up. And I’m not sure how that is “interpreted”.

    You are correct, just because something is specifically left out of scripture doesn’t mean it is wrong. I will grant you that. Without getting into a huge debate though, I think without too much effort there are plenty of other scriptures backing up this point. And I don’t think any of them are written in a way that is vague, uses a lot of imagery or leaves one wondering what was really meant.

    Yes, God does teach love and tolerance. You are right again. God is love and he is pure and Holy and just. Which also means there are things that go against God that people do anyway. So, to say God is “discriminitory” is true in a sense. Everything is not allowed, which is one of the reason why he gave us the scriptures so we can know what he thinks is right and what is wrong.

    I mean, as an example, do you think that someone who broke the law and was arrested and brought before a judge and the judge said, “I don’t care what this person did or didn’t do, dismissed!”. Would that be justice?

    Sorry to ramble on but I think this is the basic Christian belief. I’m not perfect. I have broken the law. I deserve to be punished. That is why Christ came to be a sacrifice for me. He took the punishment that I deserved! I mean, how great is that?!?!

  17. Daniel,

    “What in particular about gay people being involved would make it any more “messy”?”

    I simply said both gay marriage and gay divorce are messy. There was no comparison to real marriage. I don’t fall for baiting, sorry.

    “Today [gay] marriage is less about love and more about taxes and benefits. Ridiculous.”

    Again, talking about gay marriage. What reason is there for two gays to marry? Love? Please. You can love and not be married just as much as you can be married and miserable. The purpose for gay marriage? The ‘real’ purpose? Health care benefits, tax breaks, and medical life decisions. Don’t buy me love.

    When important decisions are made because of how somebody feels or because their good intentions, then it is already wrong. Don’t cry to me when we are all guilt-tripped into socialism over the next 10 years. Don’t say I didn’t warn you. We all need to get off the fence and get a backbone.

  18. Marriage is a committment of an amazing connection between two souls so long as it’s done right. I always believed you get married once because you are making that committment to one person forsaking all others. I have seen others around me fall out of that committment and I am not stranger to it. If you have the grace and blessing to find that connection again, then you should do what you can to make sure it’s right and give 100% to love and honor each other.

  19. I don’t fall for baiting, sorry.

    Well that’s good. Especially since I wasn’t “baiting” you. I was quoting you.

    So, since you just said, “There was no comparison to real marriage” I can only assume, as I did before, that your comment applied to only gay marriage and gay divorce. In which case, my original question to you, about marriage and divorce, still stands: What in particular, about gay people being involved, would make it any more “messy”?

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